Prometheus 6

"How many of these prerequisites for survival are politically supported by Republicans? Conservatives? Libertarians"

All of them I'd say.

Outside of Islamists, deep green Eco-radicals, white supremacist lunatics and anarchists almost all political groups in America are in favor of the fundamental aspects of civilization. The modalities differ but most people prefer civilization to the alternative.

"Mayan, Mesopotamian, Chaco Canyon, and the Mali/Songhai civilizations"

Wow ! Speaking as a historian I doubt if I could put together a grouping with less analagous relevance to the 21st century United States. In fact, these civilizations have little in common with each other.

The modalities differ but most people prefer civilization to the alternative.

Hey, did I use a small 'l' or a capita; one???

People favor civilization, but they don't seem to realize it when their actions run counter to that. So

Society tends to become less politically centralized

Let's devolve all control back to the state and local level, and

Less investment is made in elements such as architecture, art, and literature.

…let's make sure the NEA doesn't fund anything offensive, and

the flow of information among people slows

…let's cripple the FOIA, control access to all real information, using our greatest discipline to stay on message.

Every society must be able to answer the basic biological needs of its members: food, drink, shelter, and medical care.

What?? Subsidizing subsistance?

Every society must provide for the production and distribution of goods and services (perhaps through a division of labor, rules concerning property and trade, or ideas about the role of work).

And two of these three options are being seriously undermined by free market extremists.

Every society must provide for the training (education, apprenticeship, passing on of values) of an individual so that he or she can become a functioning adult in the society.

…which can't be done when education is a commodity priced such that people simply can't buy it.

Every society must provide for the maintenance of internal and external order (laws, courts, police, wars, diplomacy).

…note the requirement if for order, not law…in particular, not the kind of law that looks like order but is functionally disruptive as hell.

Every society must provide meaning and motivation to its members.

Black guy speaking: We have come up serious short here, for Black folks. Probably colors my view of the whole thing.

"Mayan, Mesopotamian, Chaco Canyon, and the Mali/Songhai civilizations"

Wow ! Speaking as a historian I doubt if I could put together a grouping with less analagous relevance to the 21st century United States. In fact, these civilizations have little in common with each other.

That's why I found it interesting they could draw conclusions as they did.

Civilization actually precedes the Great Society, rumor has it that it may even have preceded the New Deal ;o)

Centralization also has been the bane of civilizations - Ming and Q'ing China, Diocletian's economic " reforms " that sent the Western Roman empire into an irreversible decline, Soviet central planning that turned the nation with the world's richest agricultural resources into a net food importer...Political centralization also did not help either the ancient Egyptians, Persians or the Aztecs defeat foreign invaders with new technologies.

Closer to home I could easily make the case that much of what ails the poor - dysfunctional school systems, high illegitimacy rates, the decline of marriage and fatherhood, limited job opportunities for unskilled workers - are the result or byproduct of Liberal social policies and court decisions.

The social fabric has been unraveled from more than just one side

I grant that there are cenbtralized ways of screwing things up, but I can't think of a decentralized way to put things together correctly.

Closer to home I could easily make the case that much of what ails the poor - dysfunctional school systems, high illegitimacy rates, the decline of marriage and fatherhood, limited job opportunities for unskilled workers - are the result or byproduct of Liberal social policies and court decisions.

I've heard the anecdotal evidence for those cases. And of course I could make the case&heliip;I just made. That there are necessities for civilization that are opposed in principle by too significant a fraction of the populace.