Prometheus 6

Well, I've gotten myself hip-deep in conversational shit over at Blogcritics. The post itself I duplicated here. The comments are great, though. Eric Olsen is my primary conversational partner…we're disagreeing on certain levels, but I can't even call him a conversational opponent.

Comment 16 posted by Eric Olsen on May 11, 2004 08:11 AM:

P6, I find the notion of different cultures providing different things very interesting and most likely true, but I think it reinforces my point that identifying too strongly with a single "culture" (technically subculture within the larger American culture) is constraining. As African-American culture has informed American culture to a remarkably large degree, so has "American" culture informed "African-American" culture. What would American culture be without African-American culture? Look to Europe. What would African-American culture we without American culture? Look to Africa. I would argue the larger, hybrid (also with strong Latin-American, Asian, Caribbean, American Indian, etc influences) American culture is stronger, more vibrant, more transcendent than any of them.

The "melting pot" notion is cliched but real and by not embracing the larger whole I think we limit ourselves. I am far more "Black" than my Norwegian cousins - this is a great thing. You P6 are far more "white" than your African cousins, and despite the grim, evil, dehumanizing, inexcusable legacy of slavery in America, at this point in time - with slavery 150 years gone, official segregation 50 years gone, civil rights legislation 40 years on the books, and opportunity aavailable to those who would avail themselves of it - I think you are better off than your African cousins as I am vis-a-vis my Norwegian cousins.

I would say taking pride in African-American contributions to the larger American culture is just as valid a source of Maslowian belonging as identifying with the narrower "African-American" culture, and that each of us identifying with this larger culture - to which we have all contributed - might be the best path forward.

Unfortunately, we cannot alter the past, only deal with its legacy as best we can.

Comment 23 posted by P6 on May 11, 2004 12:02 PM:

Eric:

This conversation is turning out better than I thought it might.

P6, I find the notion of different cultures providing different things very interesting and most likely true, but I think it reinforces my point that identifying too strongly with a single "culture" (technically subculture within the larger American culture) is constraining.

You miss the point. Regardless of the fact that American culture is a pastiche of European, American Indian and African culture with significant additions from other European derivatives, it too is a single culture, and therefore limited by its nature.

There will always be those for whom American culture is insufficient, or damaging, or a mere starting point. And primary among them are the people who America will not accept as members.

Again I ask: can you honestly say, to this day, that the USofA acknowledges Black Americans as full members? And if you think so, survey the cultural landscape and tell me how Black Americans will know this.

Unfortunately, we cannot alter the past, only deal with its legacy as best we can.

No doubt. But understand that you and I are dealing with different aspects of that legacy.

What problems does racism cause you, a reasonably well-educated white male from a fairly upper middle class background?

What problems does racism cause me, a 6'2" 185 lb Black male, self-educated, no degree, had to work up from messenger to Assistant VP at a bank, father a farmer, mother a laborer that eventually got a nice safe civil service job?

Feel me?

Check my discussion. I see the past but I'm not living there. I have, by mainstream standards, been a success. I am not someone who is complaining because they couldn't make it.

I would say taking pride in African-American contributions to the larger American culture is just as valid a source of Maslowian belonging as identifying with the narrower "African-American" culture, and that each of us identifying with this larger culture - to which we have all contributed - might be the best path forward.

It would be.

If the mainstream would allow it.